Engine Room No 5 Amy H Sturgis

[VanamondeSubscriber]

In regards to YA scifi and fantasy. It seems to me there is is far less snobbery against genre fiction when it’s aimed at the kiddies. Authors can be applauded without all the backsliding that occurs in the adult arena, reasons are given as to why the book isn’t scifi (no squids in space…). 

[the english assassinSubscriber]

ahs wrote:

Also, my article &quot]

Interesting article. I’m not sure if I really see a great deal to link HP with JR to be honest… or at least I think that there is far more to distinguish them from each other as writers and men, but you say potato I say Yog Sothoth…

 

I think that the recent rise in HP’s popularity (although still only a cult figure really and dwarfed by Tolkien’s popularity) is partially due to the resent critical re-evaluation of his work over the last 10 years or so by ST Joshi & co (the biographical stuff is great but some of the critical theory imposed on HP’s mythos is highly pretentious) and the restoration of the text to their original form, but mainly due to the drip drip of Lovecraftian influences in the genre world outside of fiction, specifically gaming; while the Tolkien Zeitgeist of a few years ago has been as far as I can see entirely driven by the movies, although unlike HP’s mere cult appeal, JR has always been a heavy-weight as far as(well at least since the 60s) . It’ll be interesting to see what effect those over hyped and over CGIed films will have on Tolkien’s long term popularity.

 

It has to be said that I’m not a Neil Gaimen fan, but in what way is HP like ‘rock’n'roll?’ Rock’n'roll is dumb, fun, shallow, popular and accessible. It was loved by teens across the globe. The cook cats dug jazz. Lovecraft is intellectual, serious (or more so than his contemporaries and the many hacks that pastiche him), philosophical, very niche and to most peoples tastes incredibly hard going. He’s about as anti-teenager as it’s possible to be. High school kids don’t get him. In fact they’ve never heard of him. He isn’t popular and he is very cool indeed. Maybe I’m missing something or taking him out of context (maybe I need to track down the documentary – is it any good?) but… he annoys the hell out of me. Am I alone? Probably…

 

[ahsSubscriber]

the english assassin wrote:

Interesting article. I’m not sure if I really see a great deal to link HP with JR to be honest… or at least I think that there is far more to distinguish them from each other as writers and men, but you say potato I say Yog Sothoth…

Actually, as writers, I think they go in opposing directions, except that both draw on the same kinds of mythologies (Icelandic, Germanic, etc.) as inspirations and recognize the importance of myth for the human psyche. My main idea is that both men were asking the same questions of the era in which they found themselves; they just found radically different answers. I tend to think the questions the asked are of particular import today and help to account for both authors’ popularity. Your mileage may vary, of course. At any rate, thanks for reading the article!

I’d tend to disagree, though, about young people knowing HPL. It’s amazing the number of times young students – 18 -year-old freshmen – bring their plush Cthulhus and Miskatonic University shirts to class when they know they get to discuss Lovecraft. The Lovecraft panels at SF cons I’ve attended have been packed with young audience members who are consumers of Cthulhu role-playing games, podcasts (there are some great HPL-inspired ones out there, including Cthulhu and Yog-Sothoth), films, music (from Nox Arcana and the Mountain Goats to the Darkest of the Hillside Thickets and Paul Roland), and even fiction (Gaiman’s Lovecraft-inspired works included) that have led them directly to Lovecraft’s own fiction. The thriving businesses of companies like Chaosium and fan groups like the H.P. Lovecraft Historical Society also point to this. Lovecraft definitely is in fashion these days with the younger set,  at least in my experience. I would guess the rock-n-roll reference comes as much from the "hip" factor as the subversiveness of the phenomenon. Just my two cents. 

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My Website: http://amyhsturgis.com
My Blog: http://eldritchhobbit.livejournal.com
My Goodreads: http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/785795.Amy_H_Sturgis

[MarkBSubscriber]

ahs wrote:

the english assassin wrote:

Actually, as writers, I think they go in opposing directions, except that both draw on the same kinds of mythologies (Icelandic, Germanic, etc.) as inspirations and recognize the importance of myth for the human psyche. My main idea is that both men were asking the same questions of the era in which they found themselves; they just found radically different answers. I tend to think the questions the asked are of particular import today and help to account for both authors’ popularity. Your mileage may vary, of course. At any rate, thanks for reading the article!

I’d tend to disagree, though, about young people knowing HPL. It’s amazing the number of times young students – 18 -year-old freshmen – bring their plush Cthulhus and Miskatonic University shirts to class when they know they get to discuss Lovecraft. The Lovecraft panels at SF cons I’ve attended have been packed with young audience members who are consumers of Cthulhu role-playing games, podcasts (there are some great HPL-inspired ones out there, including Cthulhu and Yog-Sothoth), films, music (from Nox Arcana and the Mountain Goats to the Darkest of the Hillside Thickets and Paul Roland), and even fiction (Gaiman’s Lovecraft-inspired works included) that have led them directly to Lovecraft’s own fiction. The thriving businesses of companies like Chaosium and fan groups like the H.P. Lovecraft Historical Society also point to this. Lovecraft definitely is in fashion these days with the younger set,  at least in my experience. I would guess the rock-n-roll reference comes as much from the "hip" factor as the subversiveness of the phenomenon. Just my two cents. 

And let’s not forget the "Munchkin Cthulhu" card game.  One of my students had it at school last week.  I don’t think this eleven year old knows who Lovecraft is, but it is only a matter of time. 

There’s so many paths out there to Lovecraft.  For me it was the "Hellboy" comics by Mike Mignola.

And I’m listening to The Mountain Goats "Lovecraft In Brooklyn" right now…

 

[the english assassinSubscriber]

I agree there certainly has been the ka-ching! ka=ching! of merchandising of Lovecraft in recent years and I’m not surprised to hear that with the relative niches of sf fandom and weird fiction academia (not that I’m slagging off those niches as to some extent I too inhabit them); however I doubt that HP has a much greater appeal beyond that. Certainly I can’t see Cthulhu and Yog Sothoth becoming the new Pokemon or Harry Potter, although the proposed Del Toro ‘Mountains of Madness’ film might change my opinion…

In fairness to Gaimen, as he’s hardly the first to say that such and such is the new rock’n'roll (comedy or sport being forever put forward by pundits and culture vultures), but if only because we live in such highly differentiated times it is almost impossible to imagine anything being as culturally important as rock’n'roll, with the possible exception of hip-hop. Maybe a better analogue for Lovecraft would have been very fine band The Velvet Underground (rather than an entire pop culture scene of the 1950s and everything that follows). They say (whoever ‘they’ are) that although the Velvets were a huge commercial disaster in their own time, that everyone who heard them formed a band (Bowie, Roxy Music…). When the Velvets reformed in the 90s they sold out stadiums and flogged some new merchandise, etc, but it was fairly banal. Seems the same could be said for Lovecraft. A cult figure in his own time, but never a populist one (never had a front cover of Weird Tales in his lifetime), but his influence has been huge. The various mythos pastiches are, in my eyes, nothing more than a bunch of second rate indie bands pretending they’re the Velvets (lets say the very good Spaceman 3): occasionally fun but pretty vacuous and no one has heard of them ten years later (which is a pity – check them out)…

In fairness I’m obviously thinking about this far more than such a throw away remark deserves but I can’t help myself… It’s a compulsion… Time for a cuppa!

[alllieSubscriber]

Cthulhu religious tract: Make yourself safe for the return of the Old Ones

[ahsSubscriber]

Vanamonde wrote:

In regards to YA scifi and fantasy. It seems to me there is is far less snobbery against genre fiction when it’s aimed at the kiddies. Authors can be applauded without all the backsliding that occurs in the adult arena, reasons are given as to why the book isn’t scifi (no squids in space…).&nbsp]

Excellent point! I think you’re quite right.

Oh, and MarkB, I am listening to "Lovecraft in Brooklyn" as I type this.

 

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My Website: http://amyhsturgis.com
My Blog: http://eldritchhobbit.livejournal.com
My Goodreads: http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/785795.Amy_H_Sturgis

[ahsSubscriber]

alllie wrote:

Cthulhu religious tract: Make yourself safe for the return of the Old Ones

This is a hoot! I love the three steps at the end.

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My Website: http://amyhsturgis.com
My Blog: http://eldritchhobbit.livejournal.com
My Goodreads: http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/785795.Amy_H_Sturgis

[VanamondeSubscriber]

Fredosphere wrote:

&quot]

 

Do you listen to the Geologic podcast?

 

[FredosphereSubscriber]

Vanamonde wrote:

Fredosphere wrote:

&quot]

Do you listen to the Geologic podcast?

No, never ‘eard of it.  What’s it about?

 

[VanamondeSubscriber]

Hard to explain:

 

http://www.geologicpodcast.com/

 

But he uses the expression you used a lot of the time. But be warned he is an atheist and a skeptic.

[divadianeSubscriber]

Amy and Tony – great, grrrrrreat interview! I’m so glad that you didn’t get to all your questions for Amy, Tony, because that means we can look forward to another one sometime.

[the english assassinSubscriber]

Just caught the show: very good it was too. I have to agree that Trillion Year Spree (Brian Aldiss) is a great history of of sf. As far as I’m aware Aldiss caught quite a bit of flack at the time for suggesting that sf comes from the gothic tradition. Seems kind of obvious now, of course, but stil its a great book. I do see many similarities with historical novels and sf. I think any displacement from the ‘now’ (past, future or best of all ‘other’)allows an author to focus the spot light on the specifics with far more intensity than more mundane settings.

[ChurchSubscriber]

wrote:

And let’s not forget the &quot]

Is that Pokethulhu? Or another one?

[JagashSubscriber]

Excellent interview and I agree that the Lovecraftian sub-genre seems to be all the rage.    I think it’s resurgance of popularity is  a response to the culture of suspicion and fear that has been growing in western society after 9-11.  It’s an easy way to poke fun at doom, gloom and fear in a sort of reductio ad absurdium kind of thing.    Hard to be afraid of hidden terrrists if the Great Old Ones are brought up as contrast.

 

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